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August 20, 2008, 07:50:19 AM *
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Author Topic: Water Heater TPR piping  (Read 1869 times)
Jay Markanich
Location: Bristow VA
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« Reply #15 on: May 17, 2008, 04:50:57 PM »

Dave - Sorry, I've been gone from early to late with no energy left over for messaging and the like.  I understand and appreciate what you are saying.  The point of my verbose commentary was to applaud you for your foresight in changing the verbiage in your reporting.  To restate the obvious, I think there are substantial reasons for needing to do that!  You might even want to have a legal professional look at it.

Because of the changes to our society we, as home inspectors, are ever more exposed to liability for hidden things we might miss.  It threatens our businesses, livelihoods, and the lifestyles our families enjoy.  Our reporting software and agreements need wording to help reduce our various exposures.

It may not be the problem for you there that it is for me here, but I am seeing horrific stuff, unthinking and just plain scary work in houses I am inspecting for clients.  I am fed up, as I should be!  And the lack of professionalism in new construction generally perturbs me as an inspector.  So many do not treat others as they would wish to be treated themselves.  I fear that attitude is becoming more pervasive.  As they might say in rural Virginia, "Ahm afeered it ain't agonna git no better."

Bottom line - ANYTHING we can do to lessen or mitigate our exposure to hidden problems is only to our benefit as individuals and professionals.  Good job on the rewording!
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www.jaymarinspect.com
Northern Virginia Home Inspector
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC
Northern Virginia Home Inspector
Festina Lente - Make Haste Slowly
Jay Markanich
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« Reply #16 on: May 20, 2008, 03:16:50 AM »

Hey Dave!  Yesterday, on one of my inspections, the water heater TPR had no where to drain...  With a tear in my eye, I told my buyer (investor, six houses) of a home inspector friend in Colorado who ran across the same thing a couple of days ago.  He was impressed - this does not happen often.

I told him that in your case there was no easy solution.  At this house, a 30 year old pre-fab ranch plopped onto a poured concrete foundation, the improperly wired and plumbed water heater was beside a foundation wall through which a hole could be drilled and the TPR drained to a sump pump at the bottom of an exterior stair well.  The solution was a little difficult, but possible.

We looked at the sump pump.  It was plugged into a three-pronged interior extension cord, sharing that extension cord with a freezer and space heater on the screened back porch above.  The grounding prong was cut off of all three devices, well, so they could be plugged in.  The extension cord comes out of the bottom of the door.  It is plugged into an outlet on the wall.  The outlet (no cover) is hanging on the wall attached to Romex which goes into a hole leading into the house.  This Romex comes into the only bathroom, half way up the wall, leads down onto the floor, around behind the toilet and up the wall beside the sink.  It goes under the bottom of the cover plate on the GFI on the wall and pig-tailed into it.  The GFI was tripped (can't imagine why).

This GFI is doing yeoman's work.  When it is tripped so is everything in the bathroom - light, fan AND electric wall heater (!!!).  AND half the kitchen outlets, including the fridge and disposal.  AND the dining room outlets and light.  AND half the living room outlets.  AND both front bedrooms, outlets and ceiling fans.  AND another Romex coming out of the top of the cover plate, similarly pig-tailed, leading to a hole in the ceiling, and servicing a similar outlet box (no cover) in the attic, into which is plugged another interior extension cord.  Into this extension cord is plugged a hanging light bulb AND an attic fan.

This GFI is the equivalent of the Kennedy magic bullet!  I turned it back on thinking I would explode, but didn't...

On the sales contract are five male names, apparently heads of the various households living there.  In the house I counted 13 children's cribs and beds.  This does not mean that there are only 13 children living in the house.  Everyone shares this one little bathroom and the Yeoman GFI...

There is no point telling you about the other electrical, plumbing, appliance or HVAC issues.  YIKES!!!

But I am happy to report that we figured out how to discharge that TPR valve!

Oh, the stuff in the freezer was all moldy.  And in the fridge...  And the sump pump did not work.

I am NOT making this up - it was my most fun inspection all day!

Ahm afeered it ain't agonna git no better...
« Last Edit: May 20, 2008, 03:24:52 AM by Jay Markanich » Logged

www.jaymarinspect.com
Northern Virginia Home Inspector
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC
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Dominic Maricic
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« Reply #17 on: May 20, 2008, 04:34:42 AM »

Wow. 13 cribs..... How many bedroom house was this (sharing one bathroom)?
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Dominic Maricic
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Jay Markanich
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« Reply #18 on: May 20, 2008, 04:49:34 AM »

Three officially, with "three" in the basement...  I see it all the time.
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Festina Lente - Make Haste Slowly
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« Reply #19 on: May 20, 2008, 04:53:38 AM »

I thought that was more of a west coast issue.
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Dominic Maricic
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Jay Markanich
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« Reply #20 on: May 20, 2008, 05:00:19 AM »

¡No, no, no señor!
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www.jaymarinspect.com
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Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC
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Bob Elliott
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« Reply #21 on: May 20, 2008, 07:19:24 AM »

Happened in my last neighborhood.
Suddenly could not park in front anymore.
Investers buy a house then overcharge rent to the innigrants.
Ruins the neighborhood, with garage fires and drug deals springing up all over the place.
Aren't open borders great?
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David A. Keating
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« Reply #22 on: May 20, 2008, 08:03:19 AM »

Yikes! I'm not seeing that here in Denver yet, but I'm sure its here. How long did it take you to write the report? How many sq. ft.?, what do you charge there. Sounds like your earning your $$$.
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Jay Markanich
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« Reply #23 on: May 20, 2008, 08:25:33 AM »

Yes, Bob, yummie, open borders!  There are sections of little Manassas VA I will not go.  I will get robbed or my truck damaged, and then if I go to defend myself I would be attacked by 15.  I would have no choice but to shoot somebody to protect myself, and, since I don't want to do that, I will not go there.  It is happening neighborhood by neighborhood out here.  The schools are overrun and dangerous and people are moving to get away from them.  Recently, Investor's Business Daily estimated, based on various financial statistics, that there are 50-60 million illegals here right now.   Geez, there are 52 million social security numbers being used illegally right now...  our county just made an arrest at a golf course and bagged 17 illegals.  They were all using the same social...!  If they all get amnesty, expect their relatives - 4, 5, 6 per illegal - and THEN imagine what will happen to the neighborhoods!!

Dave - I am still wiping the tear from my eye...!  I charge $1 per thou$and for an inspection, with a max of $500 (plus radon, thermal, etc).  If I don't cap it I will get pushed out of the upper market.  For foreclosures I am tacking on an extra $50 because of the extra time.  That report took about 1 hour to put together.  My usual report takes 15 - 20 minutes.  I have a lot of commentary pre-written and just highlight it to print at the end.  You have to be real specific on the commentary!  That little house, both first floor and basement together, could not be more than 1200 square feet.  When I said I am seeing "horrific stuff," I mean it!  We theeenk we be earning our money...
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www.jaymarinspect.com
Northern Virginia Home Inspector
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC
Northern Virginia Home Inspector
Festina Lente - Make Haste Slowly
David A. Keating
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« Reply #24 on: May 20, 2008, 08:10:50 PM »

$1 per thousand what?
I just performed a New Construction Inspection here today, about 1500 sq.ft., I spent 4 1/2 hours at the home, and then 2 1/2 hours to create the report and upload it to the web. That's 7 hours so far and I charge $225. Thats aprox. $32 per hour and I'm not done yet time wise phone consulting etc. + fuel etc.     
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Bob Elliott
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« Reply #25 on: May 20, 2008, 08:26:35 PM »

David ,your prices are to low and you need to raise them.
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Dominic Maricic
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« Reply #26 on: May 20, 2008, 08:53:32 PM »

He also needs to switch to Home Inspector Pro if it's taking 2.5 hours (cough cough, hehe). There was a nice post by Bob and then Bert here: http://www.nachi.org/forum/showthread.php?p=360061#post360061 where Bert talks about HIP cutting his report time in half.

Dave, I think Jay is saying he charges based on the homes selling price, $1 per thousand dollars. Do a $250,000 house would cost $250 for the inspection. Am I correct in that Jay?
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Dominic Maricic
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« Reply #27 on: May 20, 2008, 09:00:18 PM »

Bob,
Where are you located? Do you post your pricing?
Look at mine, click here: http://www.denversbesthomeinspector.com
and click on my pricing. Problem is, I check when I can here, and when some inspector posts his pricing, I'm right in there........... but as usual many don't post their pricing. Some jacka$$'$ advertise $200 w/ free radon test, how do you compete with that? (I dont try) I will not match prices if asked. They are what they are.
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Jay Markanich
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« Reply #28 on: May 20, 2008, 09:16:02 PM »

Dave - If the house costs $385,000, I charge $385 for the inspection.  Or, in other words, $1 per thousand in value.  My minimum is $250 and max is $500.  For real expensive houses that maximum is a great price around here.  There are realtors here who specialize in the high-end stuff and they all know me.  Still, despite a good price, you have to render a great inspection - most veteran realtors are real savvy and know when you screw up and it gets around an office pretty quick.  For the amount of time your process takes you, Dave, it might sound like you are not charging enough...  but, your market really determines that price, not you necessarily.  Your clients do not appreciate the amount of time you spend, only the product you come up with in the end.
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www.jaymarinspect.com
Northern Virginia Home Inspector
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC
Northern Virginia Home Inspector
Festina Lente - Make Haste Slowly
Jay Markanich
Location: Bristow VA
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« Reply #29 on: May 20, 2008, 09:18:49 PM »

Dave - Postscript - I had another TPR today with no place to vent!
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www.jaymarinspect.com
Northern Virginia Home Inspector
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC
Northern Virginia Home Inspector
Festina Lente - Make Haste Slowly
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